Big Food vs. the People

(lighthousereports.com)

90 points | by jruohonen 2 hours ago

7 comments

  • irthomasthomas 32 minutes ago
    "Senators don't have the luxury that a research scientist has of waiting for evidence." - 1977

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbFQc2kxm9c

  • arthurjj 55 minutes ago
    I'm about as hippie with my food as you can get, but this "article" is badly written propaganda that conceals more than it reveals. Half way down the article you learn that ~80% (193 out of 239) of the lawsuits are in Mexico and

    > many of them were against the country’s labelling regulation. Quinto Elemento Lab reveals the companies’ arguments: that the laws were a violation of their constitutional rights

    But the article doesn't say what those rights are, which makes me think the lawsuits were just

    • thegrim33 31 minutes ago
      People have to learn to recognize the patterns.

      In this case, lighthouse reports is an international NGO which receives on the order of ~1MM in income per year (an extremely common pattern for these NGOs), which was directly given to them by (unspecified) government grants and (unnamed) private donors (can see all this in their openly published annual reports). In exchange for the funding (80.38% of which they paid out to themselves as wages/compensation), they put together and release "reports", "studies", etc., that push the messaging the NGO was created to push.

      • dfxm12 25 minutes ago
        1MM in any currency doesn't sound like a lot, especially relative to who they're up against...
        • mikem170 13 minutes ago
          Sounds like enough to pay some people for some months or a year or two - a combination of experts, part-time specialists, cotractors, etc. - to do things like gather some data via their contacts, hack together a meta-study, put out a glossy report andsome press releases, etc.
    • MathMonkeyMan 4 minutes ago
      Mexico is serious about junk food.

      The cereal boxes in the stores don't have cute cartoon characters on them, and I tried to send somebody a box of chocolates and it got seized by customs.

      Candy is labeled like cigarettes.

  • nickff 1 hour ago
    The measures related to lawsuits are misleading and terrible, because of the way class-action lawsuits have incentivized lawyers to pursue dubious cases against large companies.
    • analog31 35 minutes ago
      I'm not in love with the system, but it does seem like a last resort for imposing discipline on corporations. The dilemma is whether the tort system is preferable to an approach involving more regulation and enforcement.
      • nickff 27 minutes ago
        I’m not saying that the lawsuits are necessarily wrong or bad (though there do seem to be many of dubious merit), just that they don’t accurately reflect the mix of safety and other problems between large and small producers.
    • wombat-man 58 minutes ago
      Don't they still need to win to get paid?
      • strictnein 54 minutes ago
        They're purchasing lottery tickets that are mostly paid for by tax payers who fund the court systems.
        • Guvante 16 minutes ago
          There should be publicly available data about how expensive class action lawsuits are to the court.

          I would personally categorize it as as subsidized not paid for since the lawyers get nothing if they fail which is a meaningful cost.

          None of this is to say I support the current system. Class action lawsuits are now designed to get settlements that save the company targeted millions or more compared to the actual damage agreed to.

          And giving the lawyers millions when each litigant is lucky to get $20 is not reasonable.

        • BigTTYGothGF 18 minutes ago
          The only direct costs to the taxpayers in these kinds of lawsuits are the judge's time (also the bailiff's, stenographer's, and a couple more), a slight extra load on the computer system to handle the filings, and miscellaneous wear and tear on the courtroom.
        • jt2190 26 minutes ago
          - “Purchasing”: The attorneys that are taking these cases for $0 in the hopes that they’ll get n% of $SETTLEMENT

          - “paid for by tax payers who fund the court systems”. The alternative would mean taking away the right of private citizens to sue.

          • strictnein 19 minutes ago
            I mean, I think you understand what I'm saying. They're externalizing the costs and internalizing the benefits. The same thing we complain about with numerous other industries.

            The alternative would not be to take away the right of private citizens to sue. There is, surprisingly enough, quite a chasm between identifying that some parties are taking advantage of a system and completely shutting that system down.

        • m463 22 minutes ago
          aren't the court systems pretty self-funding?
      • bluGill 54 minutes ago
        Winning one and losing five is in their favor.
      • dfxm12 28 minutes ago
        No. The case can be settled out of court. This doesn't necessarily mean lawsuits are misleading or terrible as measures.
  • thatmf 5 minutes ago
    Fantastic infographics!
  • jruohonen 2 hours ago
  • connor11528 1 hour ago
    america has a monopoly problem
    • rootusrootus 1 hour ago
      Indeed if we could solve one thing with our gov't, I'd want it to be antitrust enforcement. For an ostensibly free market society we seem awfully willing to accept it being anything but.
      • Straw 10 minutes ago
        If you wanted to do the most to improve competitiveness possible, by far the most effective strategy would be free trade. Trade barriers prevent competition from overseas, making monopolies much easier to maintain.
      • m463 19 minutes ago
        I'd like corporations (bodies) to be prosecuted like human bodies, where bad behavior was noted, you got a record, and punishment increased through fines, restrictions all the way to forms of incarceration, and even the death penalty.
      • kibwen 55 minutes ago
        Free markets tend to produce monopolies. You know how economies of scale are a thing? That's another way of saying that small companies lose to large companies at scale. "Disruption" or "agility" is the only thing that small companies have going for them, but once the monopolist gets large enough they can just buy up any upstarts and keep the market all to themselves forever. This is why you require governments to periodically shake the snowglobe and restore markets to competitiveness... until the monopolist gets big enough that they just buy the government, anyway.
        • Straw 12 minutes ago
          No, governments tend to produce monopolies.

          Can you find true monopolies in the free market, in the last 100 years, that have lasted for at least 20 years, without some kind of government backing/suppression of competitors? I only know of one.

          Things only count as monopolies if they have monopoly pricing power; Google is not a monopoly, they cannot even charge 1 cent per search.

          In practice, despite economies of scale, large companies age and become bloated, inflexible, etc. So there's typically plenty of room for new companies to compete.

          If a monopolist buys all upstarts, then that creates an even stronger incentive to make competing businesses! You don't even have to succeed in the market, you just have to get bought up! The more they buy out, there stronger incentive there will be to enter the market. No one can do this indefinitely- except with some kind of government support- say a regulation that makes it difficult to enter the market.

        • pphysch 46 minutes ago
          Exactly. If you ask anyone on the street, "is it easier for a fast food worker or a business-owning millionaire to make their next million dollars?", common sense will prevail.

          Money begets money (and power). It doesn't require an economics degree to understand this positive feedback loop.

    • arthurjj 43 minutes ago
      The article says 80% of the lawsuits were in Mexico and ~3% were in America.
    • artisinal 1 hour ago
      In many European countries, the largest restaurant chain is American. Not great.
      • bluGill 52 minutes ago
        You seem to be assuming chains are good. I prefer the one location restaurant myself, but by definition they will never be the largest chain.
      • cbg0 49 minutes ago
        McDonald's might be the largest restaurant chain in Italy but that doesn't really mean much given how many small restaurants the country has with high quality food.
    • IncreasePosts 37 minutes ago
      I think chess and scrabble are more popular here
    • dhosek 1 hour ago
      [dead]
    • black_13 1 hour ago
      [dead]
    • dabbz 1 hour ago
      True, we have way too many thematic versions of Monopoly. I'm still missing so many copies.
  • EGreg 1 hour ago